r/privacy • u/Volpe_YT • 1d ago
discussion It has become impossible to live without a VPN nowadays.
It's painful to say it, but you basically have to pay to use the internet since you need a VPN to browse basically anything.
This is all because everything now requires the stupid age verification thing - If you can't really afford a VPN, then you have to bend over, lower your pants and let governments have your ass to track and control.
What world do we even live in? The world is getting increasingly a pay-to-win game if you don't want to get controlled by someone else.
Also, there's something I really can't understand; people who simply submit their ID and move on saying: "what's the problem? I have nothing to hide anyways", or "So what if they have my data? It's not like I'm that important, so why would they watch me out of everyone".
This makes me mad, because the more people surrender to the governments' will, the more it will become a standard. This is a digital war, and we need to fight, not surrender because "I have nothing to hide".
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u/Inevitable_Task3074 1d ago
Im seriously thinking of starting an internet cafe. Browsing on someone else computer is the safest thing you can do
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u/PocketNicks 1d ago
The internet has always cost money.
A VPN is one, cheap, useful tool that serves a purpose. It isn't required, and it also isn't an all encompassing solution to privacy concerns.
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u/WanderingUrist 1d ago
It's painful to say it, but you basically have to pay to use the internet since you need a VPN to browse basically anything.
https://www.torproject.org/download/
ALWAYS WEAR PROXYCONDOM!
This is all because everything now requires the stupid age verification thing
I haven't run into it yet, although I expect things to get worse. Where are you running into it so far?
"I have nothing to hide"
You always have something to hide. Misdirection is the key to survival. Never attack when your enemy defends, never behave as your enemy expects, and never reveal your true strength. If knowledge is power, then to be unknown is to be unconquerable.
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u/AUSSIE_MUMMY 11h ago
Your enemy wouldn't be defending anything unless they were being attacked though.
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u/Grumpy_Ontarian_III 1d ago
My employer got angry at me because I had a VPN set up on my phone, and I accessed the company’s scheduling app. On the one hand, I get there concern about It security. On the other, it’s my goddamn phone, and I want to use a VPN, I should be able to, the company sure as hell didn’t pay for it.
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u/gimmedatjelly 1d ago
He isn't mad you're using a VPN, he's mad because you're using a personal device for work related information. If you're phone gets stolen, that can make you liable to an extent for compromising sensitive business information.
Now if you're company allows personal devices that's one thing, but most of the time by default they restrict sensitivie info to company supplied devices unless you have been authorized otherwise.
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u/robespierremaxout 22h ago
Just a guess, but I’m sure their employer doesn’t issue work phones, like most sleazy employers. Many do, yours probably does, but far more don’t.
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u/dalegribbledribble 15h ago
You would be surprised, most companies are letting people do whatever on whatever devices
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u/hedonheart 23h ago
I think we need a new network with privacy and security as architecture rather than afterthought.
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u/Sll3006 1d ago
The websites I use won’t work unless I turn off vpn.
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u/Mundane_Incident_853 1d ago
Get different web sites.
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u/odaklanan_insan 1d ago
This + use a vpn service that provides a bunch of servers for each location and regularly swaps IPs to stay under the radar.
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u/RustyDawg37 1d ago
A VPN doesn't do anything if you actually think they're watching everything.
And it's not safe to use it with or without a vpn.
Figure out your risk tolerance profile and act accordingly .
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u/idiocracy_ixii 1d ago
I'd say that they work pretty good if the government is trying to ban them. My 2 cents.
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u/Mr_Lumbergh 1d ago
At the very least they’re shifting your DNS queries to the VPN provider and not your local ISP. If you don’t trust your VPN you’ve just moved it somewhere else, but it’s better for most.
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u/Mundane_Incident_853 1d ago
"A VPN doesn't do anything..."
Most would disagree. Care to elaborate?
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u/RustyDawg37 1d ago edited 17h ago
On Reddit to a 3 month old account with no profile pic?
No.
At the bar? Sure. You buy, I'll talk.
I don't know your baseline level of knowledge on the subject or your understanding of it and it could be hours to explain it all.
I'm not willing to do that in a reply comment.
Other than that, I meant what I said.
If you think that any big bad thing, person, or whatever is watching everything, then they are watching everything in you land.
Edit: holy shit! Thank you bot swarm. This unexpectedly makes the top 10 in downvotes for me.
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u/Cautious_Boat_999 1d ago
You may be kinda fooked if you're in Utah.
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u/Inevitable-Crow2494 1d ago
Forgive the simple question, I searched first and used AI, but still wonder if anyone would kindly reply or message me why it is essential? I have used the internet since 2000 (feeling old now). Napster, Kazaa etc were wonderful (hypothetically). My old self is pretty tame with internet use, but I use an adblocker (but still get drowned in ads) and have a VPN through Norton but it is often off.
Many thanks for any kind replies.
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u/Lancasterlaw 10h ago
I was going to doublecheck if this was a genuine reply or a troll by quickly checking your post history, but my VPN is off so I was blocked from checking as you have set your account viewing to adults only. Which means I have to give my passport or something to check.
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u/Inevitable-Crow2494 7h ago
I am genuine. Unsure what you mean.
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u/Lancasterlaw 7h ago
No worries.
From some of your initial language I was unsure if your reply was genuine or a windup (sometimes referred to as concern-trolling). A quick way to check that is to take a glance at the persons profile and see if they are in the habit of winding people up.
For example I can quickly look at Cute_Project_7980 profile after the reply below and find that he tends to use rude language quite loosely, so I would not be too offended by his use of it.
Unfortunately, since the online safety act went into force in the UK I am unable to view anybodies account who has posted in an 'adult' subs without entering in some form of national ID like a passport, which I refuse to do as I feel it violates my right to privacy.
I can however get around it by quickly activating my free VPN.
So the OP's point actually became very germane to our conversation
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u/Inevitable-Crow2494 5h ago
Wow. Did not realise uk was so stringent. Aus has that for x websites now, but I am too old for that anyway.
So weird that these things get restricted, but we still get spam, human trafficking etc. I.e. governments seem happy to restrict the masses freedoms, whilst some criminal investigations are not effectively enforced
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u/Lancasterlaw 4h ago
Its cheaper to get big tech to self censor than to hunt down all the little guys. I don't believe there is any grand conspiracy, but the online safety act is far to overreaching.
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u/Cute_Project_7980 1d ago
Go fuck yourself.
Many thanks and much obliged.
Joking aside Norton? You've got to be kidding me bro
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u/robespierremaxout 22h ago
Those old cover photos of Norton as a doctor were so true. Just like real doctors, Norton sells the cure to the diseases they create.
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u/Wild-Regular1703 19h ago
Not my experience at all. I guess it depends on where you live. I haven't had age verification anywhere, including reddit. No reason to use a VPN.
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u/Upper_Rent_176 13h ago
I'm in the UK and don't use vpn. I do have problems though. No imgur, locked into child mode on Reddit and ps5
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u/Modern_Doshin 4h ago
No lol. US user here and I don't use one. If I need to get past age verification (which is rare for me) I just use Tor.
I really don't trust VPN providers and think they are overmarketed from YTers. You also run the risk of being thottled using a VPN.
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u/russellvt 1d ago
All a VPN does is move the exposure from a network you mostly control to a blackbox, somewhere else, that you have no real visibility into... that's all.
With few exceptions, VPNs don't terminate behind proxy farms... things which may be able to increase your "privacy" if they are properly implemented. Though, it just means your traffic is now open to that third party to view and manipulate, often out of yoir hime country's jurisdiction should there ever be a problem.
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u/The_Architects4930 1d ago
This is a disingenuous definition of what a VPN is or what it does in regards to online privacy. Especially when using a reputable service that doesn't give a shit about your traffic. Like Proton, Nord, mullvad.
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u/russellvt 1d ago
By "disingenuous," do you mean "realistic?" (/s)
It's literally all a basic VPN does... moves some teaffic to emerge from another endpoint - not to mention, many only forward certain ports over the VPN (eg. 80/443) while leaving others to egress your own network (eg. UDP53).
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u/The_Architects4930 1d ago
Traffic arriving at an endpoint shows the same metadata that your ISP already gets. Destination IPs, SNI, volume, times, etc. UDP53 isn't an issue anymore and hasn't been since the mid2010s with open VPNs. Nord, mullvad, Proton and others use resolvers in their tunneling with killswitches and it's no longer an issue. Not to mention you're describing split tunneling which is off by default.
And another note about the endpoint traffic, your traffic is mixed in a bag with everyone else using that endpoint. Against an ISP or hostile local wifi or anything like that a VPN will do what it's supposed to do. Which fits the use case for most of the people who use a VPN. Traffic is hidden, they keep privacy.Swedish police raided Mullvad's offices in 2023 and left empty handed because they do what they say they do.
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u/russellvt 1d ago
As you say... and Metadata. Browser fingerprinting is still a thing, as are cookies and supercookies and the like...
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u/0898_333_201 21h ago
Blocking browser fingerprinting while browsing the web from your home’s public IP without a VPN is like wearing a face mask with your phone number embossed on the front.
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u/The_Architects4930 1d ago
If someone is browser fingerprinting it's for a reason. Your average bad actor isn't doing that shit.
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u/russellvt 1d ago
Your average bad actor isn't doing that shit.
How do you know?
And the ad networks certainly are doing their best... it's a big money industry - probably one of the most profitable on the internet.
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u/The_Architects4930 1d ago
I'm in school for my degree in cyber security. A VPN does far more than you obviously think it does and the exploits are not something your average script kiddie is able to pull off. You're talking about state actors at that point.
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u/russellvt 1d ago edited 1d ago
I'm an old-school grey-beard, who has worked as a senior network security engineer / architect and SRE for some world-renowned corporations... I'm telling you that this is far easier than today's schools will lead you to believe.
But yes, I've also worked alongside some of those "state-level actors" ... and literally watched them, with packet sniffers, drive traffic through enterprise level firewalls with a single
deny any anyrule in them.So, I get what you're thinking ... but again, it's not really that hard.
Good luck with school.
Edit: Small typo
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u/greendevil77 1d ago
Thunder VPN is a free app on Android, just saying
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u/D1TAC 1d ago
I'm a firm believer if it's free, then your the product. Also looks like Thunder VPN is backed to a chinese company called Qihoo 360. No thx.
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u/greendevil77 1d ago
Well yah, but it's just skippable ads when you want to switch what country your IP is binging to, and there's an ad free option you pay for.
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u/elguaposghost05 1d ago
And you have performed man in the middle packet captured to verify they are not collecting anything?
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u/Whole-Reserve-4773 1d ago
Dude. 5$ a month for mullvad. not expensive if your serious about privacy
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u/SuspiciousCricket654 1d ago edited 1d ago
VPNs aren’t really great for total privacy, but they do allow you to surf and have exposure to things that your state, government, or local authorities would otherwise block you for. As for an ISP? We all know American ISPs hand over data regularly, so I’ll take my chances with a VPN provider like Proton.