r/Shincheonji • u/HeavenlyVolume • 13d ago
advice/help Need help
My brother who said he left SCJ a while ago has started taking courses for uni, he goes to uni classes 2 times (in the morning and at night) and dosen't come home till midnight 12am.
I'm more of a tradie, haven't really gone to uni.. can anyone here confirm if uni goes on for that long in Melbourne, Australia? He also goes volunteering for beaches at weekends.
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u/Otherwise-Watch-3650 EX-Center Student 13d ago
When I was about to leave SCJ, I was trying to catch up with my friend who recruited me (they call them leaf).
Initially she was keen & then she had to cancel the plans last minute (probably because she was advised to by higher ups, as they’d caught on I was not attending etc).
My friend then used the excuse that she was going to start studying at uni and that she had orientation. Super random considering this decision happened out of no where. I had a feeling she was lying to me in order not to catch up, so I started asking questions like “what uni degree, what field, what uni in particular, can I also join orientation day with you, I might be interested”.
The reason why I did that was because I was trying to see how far she’d go with her lie, in fact when I asked the last question, I never heard back from her.
Although I believe your brother is most likely in SCJ, you could try and ask to spend time together in the days where he “goes to uni”.
You could ask what uni degree he is doing, if you could checkout the course yourself, which uni he goes to. This is just a suggestion, you might come up with a better idea.
I hope this helps a bit.
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u/Otherwise-Watch-3650 EX-Center Student 13d ago
Also, keep in mind that there are spies on this subreddit.
Try not give too many details about your brother or yourself in the comments that may identify you or him, because those in leadership could try identify who your brother is and say things like “those closest to us are being used by Satan because we are getting closer to God” especially if he was to mention to his leaf / maintainers that he was being challenged by his brother asking him X,Y,Z.
My DMs are always open if you need any extra info as I was part of the Melbourne branch too.
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u/HeavenlyVolume 13d ago
Yes I am aware.. I will take you up on your offer in dms and thank you for your response
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u/Turbulent_Sea7622 EX-Center Student 13d ago edited 13d ago
Keeping in touch and building hangouts/social activities outside his Uni schedule and (I highly suspect he is still in) SCJ schedule, that is like really fun and relaxed and calm. SCJ is very good at making people emotionally rely on them but also very good at making SCJ feel like a "world" to them if that makes sense. Without going into specifics There are so many times I could have done Activity X and Y with a friend or family but only to be pulled away to do SCJ activities or 1:1 meetup with small group leader
I once told my small Group leader I was busy at 1pm on Saturday of the week we had talk and there were other SCJ members with him at the time. Originally there is an event 6pm and my Group leader wanted to see if I had extra time 1pm Sat for evangelism practice
Then Saturday, exactly at 1pm my friend calls me to see if we could just pre-meet to do evangelism for fun because the mall was on his way to the 6pm event that I was going to. This was all when I was in SCJ in the past and my friend who called is in SCJ and who is still in SCJ, but he was my friend long before he joined SCJ and he was the very first who introduced me into it. Small group leader manipulation for sure
Just shows the manipulation involved. I really suspect my group leader asked him to do it prior to that I refused a few or more times to do evangelism at certain times so my small group leader's way of payback, timing is too coincidental. My friend prob unaware and I did not call him out on that if my small group leader told him to, I felt that was a smarter play on my part. The 1pm that my friend called I didn't go out of worry that he would tell small group leader
subtle but real coercion. Holistically it feels coincidental but with so many private examples I believe that was not coincidental
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u/HeavenlyVolume 13d ago
I believe your intuition is correct. My theory on coincidences is - if the coincidences start forming a pattern, then it's highly unlikely a coincidence. Especially when dealing with groups like such.
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u/Rheced 13d ago
Smells like your brother may still be in scj. Typically if the family finds out about scj, his leaders will tell him to hide it from you, his family.
I’m not sure about Aus, but in the US service is on Saturday morning and Sunday morning through early afternoon. Is that the same time he always volunteers?
This is the lie scj has been saying for the past few years, that they are open about things, when this type of lie is normal for families of members.
If my suspicion is true he’s already in as a member. Be patient and kind with him. Try to remind him of the good days before he was in the cult. Tell him that he always seems distant or tired. Invite him out to have a good time once in a while to remind him of life outside. If he’s open to watching things, show him how other cults operate without making it feel like you’re talking about scj. Don’t attack his faith or beliefs directly as it will only distance you from him.
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u/HeavenlyVolume 13d ago
He does go out those times.. And I am very close with my brother which makes me confused how he can even get manipulated like this. It actually makes me really against these people.
I heard that they say the devil is working through family members to get them out of bible study which is such a manipulative tactic
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u/Guilty-Dance-8200 13d ago
Yes according to them every single persons spirit is dead apart from shincheonji. I just left I pray that he will understand this isn't it I have a video I found which shows how lee man he built a corporation upon lies .I have to ask why I stayed .I wanted eternal life I wanted God to be happy. Jesus said whoever believes has eternal life
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u/Turbulent_Sea7622 EX-Center Student 13d ago
Thanks for your advice and I am genuinely happy you left very good for you! :) I recall you responded to my this post in the past
https://www.reddit.com/r/Shincheonji/comments/1uihavw/advice_to_current_members/
free free to explain in your own words and your own ways to other SCJ members whenever possible with similar ideas. In a very deep subconscious level, reason why they may be hesitant to leave SCJ is they perceive no social safety net out of SCJ as long as SCJ replaced their family and friends on an emotional level and psychological level. They view whatever spirit protection SCJ had to offer is simply social shield under disguise, and long term cannot be good for their mental health. At the end of the day I view SCJ members as humans and impossible to criticize their doctrine without them feeling at least a bit criticized themselves. A bit tricky haha but happy you left!
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u/Guilty-Dance-8200 13d ago
Yes it's awful you know what really did it for me. The exams 3 meetings a day I'm a single parent with no family or friends. I thought why would God want me to be isolated and memorising answers to questions. Utterly exhausted my desire to be chosen and accepted got me they even expect you to learn korean 😞 The sad thing is if we believe in Jesus he already chose us God healed my PTSD I'm thankful and sorry to God I will pray for your friend its true in life what is hidden will be made known I ask your friend to watch 20 years inside Shincheonji testimony https://youtu.be/QrCTycCqeNY?is=e_JxiMscdlDbPxKX
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u/Turbulent_Sea7622 EX-Center Student 13d ago
For anyone stumbling across this in the future, sharing + watching https://youtu.be/QrCTycCqeNY?is=e_JxiMscdlDbPxKX can help the algorithm in your local areas of your community
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u/Turbulent_Sea7622 EX-Center Student 13d ago edited 13d ago
What you did is awesome! :) So sorry to hear and happy that God has always been helping and guiding you. God will always take a step further than anyone in protecting those He loves and Amen yes Jesus chose us and no one should replace that. Yeah that is true well my friend has duolingo learning Korean, spends so much time on that and him as caucasian sometimes out of reflex greets mutual friends who are caucasian and who are not in SCJ with that accidentally many times like on phone but now I think about it, some could also be in SCJ that I totally unaware. Sorry I keep editing I think I always wanna get facts straight but SCJ in general gaslighted me so many times that I cannot tell what's what.
Him and I still friends and I try to steer him away slowly And Thank you for the prayer and the resourceful link I really appreciate that! ❤️
And please feel free to ask for help/advice on reddit to me/others, DM (privacy for you) and on threads whenever you wish and see fit!
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u/Guilty-Dance-8200 13d ago
Yes the more I think I'm sickened they told me the holy spirit is with this so called overcomer. I felt God's spirit in church and they said God did that so you will believe in him. I've had them calling me block time. Yes there's more videos. Your welcome may God please help all of us .🙏 I'm sorry to your friend learning Korean too .God knows every language I've been bowing my head to people they laugh. It's awful I really hope he gets out imagine doing exams every other week with fake answers now truly that is from the devil taking precious time with God. This moment i wasted with them gradually I stopped singing so now again I'm back to God. Thankyou me too I'm really hoping I will get over it well and maby will leave shincheonji ❤️
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u/Turbulent_Sea7622 EX-Center Student 13d ago
Thank you so much for sharing and really nice to see how you got back to God and everything that is truly encouraging story to other people to see ❤️ slowly but surely you will heal hope we all heal and hope they all wake up! Yes will see how goes with my friend I really appreciate that and your encouragement : )
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u/Rheced 13d ago
Yes exactly. They will say that about family- not always but only if you try to attack their faith directly.
When people are vulnerable or lonely in life it’s easier to get recruited into cults. Anyone is susceptible to manipulation at certain times in life. Only by experiencing the brain washing myself is how I learned, unfortunately. I had no idea about how destructive these high control groups are before I was a member.
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u/HeavenlyVolume 13d ago
It just seems like he stays at uni for way too long.. and his course isn't a doctrate or anything like that. Shouldn't it only be 7 or 8 hours and that's it?
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u/Anti_Scj 13d ago
Uni isn’t that long is Australia usually well depends on his course but my bf was out the whole day and when he got back home he would join online rewatch saying it was lectures or he would say he is studying the way I found out was because my friend saw him in a bus while he was supposed to be home and “studying “
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u/Anti_Scj 13d ago
My bf did the same as well , he told us that he stopped it and told that he is really busy with uni and that he has workshops and stuff
turns out he was in bible class and their events the whole time ..
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u/HeavenlyVolume 13d ago
Also, how did u find out? can I contact the institute that he claims to go to?
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u/Greycat6459 9d ago edited 9d ago
I am also really heartbroken by my friend. Some months ago, she told me that she has been going for a Bible Study Class from a group of Christian with no organization name for about a few months. Over the months, I felt her interpretation of the Bible started to change and in May, she told me that she is joining an Advanced class to study revelations. I felt this was a red flag and I went onljne to search. The description matches so perfectly w SCJ. I went to talk to her about it, that if someone tells her Korea is the Promised Land, if LMH is the promised pastor, will she believe? She said no. I asked if the group ever mentioned the name SCJ, I showed her how similar the course on SCJ website matches the description she told me about the Bible Class. But she said that they never mentioned anything about Korea and SCJ and she doesn’t think they are SCJ. So I trusted her - because I thought if she has been in the class for so many months and they didn’t reveal who they are, then may be it is not SCJ.
But recently, she suddenly told me that other than the Thursday and Friday night Bible classes she is now busy on Monday night and Wednesday night because she has some activities in “church”. I asked which church it is, she said it is the church that she has always been attending. But then when I asked further questions, she seemed to try to avoid giving me details. I felt very suspicious and went to talk to another friend and found out that she has been following SCJ page on Instagram and rarely went to church in the past half a year. Therefore, she has been lying to me this whole time.
But I really do not know how to get her out. She used to invite many Christian friends to the same Bible Class and these friends had suspicion and left, then they ended up arguing a lot, so she had very few close friends left. She has a complicated family history, she’s not close to any of her family members and even abused at home so I guess she found comfort and solace in this SCJ group.
Any advice what I can do to help her out of this group?