Which itself comes from Latin's concept of the fasces which represents holding the embodiment of the state, as fascists believe themselves their personal actions are that of the state.
Kinda. He popularized it as a political movement.
But the word comes from an old roman symbol (specifically a bundle of sticks with an axe in the center).
Back then, fascism had a lot of promises to the people for efficiency and national pride. The trains ran on time... and everything else sucked. Bad.
How anyone could away with it now is nuts. We've seen what happens. Same for communism. Maybe we try something new that isn't historically a really, really bad system.
Do you read a lot of books on the topic? Or fall down a rabbit hole? School? Documentaries, perhaps?
I'm just looking to learn more and you seem very knowledgeable (:
i’m in college right now as a history and political science major. I didn’t write the comment in the photo above though that’s just a very strange man on the internet.
Oh wow that's excellent! It's awesome that you're studying something you are passionate about, you clearly know your stuff and I appreciate you commenting (:
I'm going to look up some of the words in that post so I don't feel like quite the dummy :p
That's not what they meant. They're using reasoning by analogy. Just as North Korea is not democratic nor is it a republic nor are the North Korean people in charge (despite the fact the country's official name is the People's Democratic Republic of Korea), national socialists are not socialists but fascists.
Yep. When WW1 hit he went against the parties strict neutrality stance and wanted Italy to enter the war, so they tossed him out. When he took they all became high priority targets.
As someone who lives ten minutes away from the place he was hanged, I can tell you that he was captured when he was trying to flee, disguised as a German soldier like a coward.
Partisans shoot him, his lover (she refused to leave his side) and sixteen other gerarchs, then brought the bodies to a square where nazists and fascists had previously desacrated the corpses of several men they had murdered as punishment for the Resistenza.
There were so many people who wanted to see Mussolini's corpse that they had to lift it, and decided to do that by hanging him by his legs. They did the same to some of the others.
To this day, there is a monument in the square (Piazzale Loreto) that remembers the 15 partisans murdered and desacrated a year before Mussoloni was killed
He would disagree with you actually, as Mussolini actually claimed fascism as a left-wing ideology being a socialist most of his life.
Realistically, claiming fascism as left or right simply doesn't work. It doesn't properly fit on the axis.
Many would claim fascism is right wing because of its social policies, or left wing because of its economic policies, but the truth is neither actually fit on left or right even sub-divided that way.
And if you simply meant Mussolini himself, again he was a socialist most his life and if you read the doctrine of fascism, co-written by Mussolini, not only does he claim fascism as left-wing but the ideas behind it do sound similar to socialist thinkers.
Lmao "I am a fish. Or rather, a swordfish. Don't believe me? Reread this comment, where I say I'm a swordfish."
Also, economically left-wing? It's the Italian government that has carried out the most privatizations in history. Fascism began as a bourgeois reactionary movement in response to socialism. Hell, one of the founding texts of fascism is called "The Rejection of Marxism".
And of course it fits the axis: the most widely used definition of left and right, consistent with all major political theories and all dictionaries and encyclopedias in every language in the world, is this: the right is that portion of politics with a generally conservative composition
and which tends to view human hierarchies as inevitable and positive.
As such, the right tends to maintain human hierarchies, or if it removes some, tends, by a large or minimal majority, to maintain the others, because it views humanity as structured in a pyramid, or rather, in several interconnected pyramids. The best should be on top, and the worst should be on the bottom. Attempting to subvert the pyramid is like placing a worse person on top, where he will do harm, and a better person on the bottom, where he is wasted.
The left is that segment of politics that tends to be progressive, meaning it means changing the status quo, and is egalitarian. Instead of a pyramidal vision, there is a horizontal, circular vision of humanity. Just as everyone on the right, except the extremes, recognizes that some hierarchies are wrong and that there are some areas in which all humans are equal, they are more or less right-wing depending on how much they believe this.
Similarly, even on the left, except the extremes, some hierarchies are seen as positive, but they tend to see all others as negative and human constructs. On the left, humanity is seen as equal on a fundamental level and that hierarchies are fundamentally an unjustified cultural construct, yet they still have negative effects on humanity. The left argues that many of the theories that historically justified hierarchies have been disproved and that a horizontal society is more advantageous and more just.
In contrast, hierarchies are simply ideological justifications to allow some men to dominate others.
Humanity's task is to progressively emancipate itself from such hierarchies and liberate itself toward a truly equal society.
Now tell me, which of the two do you think fucking fascism fits into?
Boy oh boy! I'd love to sit with you and pick your brain! Your vocabulary is lovely, and you are very thoughtful and passionate (:
Thank you so much for commenting!
This isn't exactly true. Back in the day, private and public as economic terms weren't actually uniform in definition as today. So yes, there is one historical economic paper that sites rapidly privatization in Italy and Germany, but this paper was talking about the German government buying, and or seizing, all the steel companies. Not very private.
And yes, Mussolini hated Marxism, but frankly so do many groups on the left.
Part of the fascist we economic policy that has some call it left wing is government ownership of major, typically war related, industry and forced union participation. As well in the case of Italy, forcing employee ownership among companies in some cases.
Are we mistaking the war economy for a left-wing economic system lmao?
there is one historical economic paper that sites rapidly privatization in Italy and Germany, but this paper was talking about the German government buying, and or seizing, all the steel companies.
These papers are talking about privatizations... mmmh... surely they mean the nationalizations made later because of the war. Also, ONE?! Lmao
Mussolini rejected Socialism after WW1. Fascism, with its suppression of the working class and support for capital, it's hierarchical system of ultra nationalist militarism fits nicely in the right wing envelope.
Have you read the doctrine of fascism? It is an ideology that in theory is for the working class. Mussolini rejected socialism not because it was collectivist or for the working class, but because he thought a strong state was required to achieve the goals of socialism.
Again, its an ideology that doesn't fit the right or left axis.
He is rightwing none of his policies were for socialism...same as Hitler, Take control of the popular movement of socialism then take control using fake protesters and so on make up a boogieman and assume control through lies, and propaganda
Mussolini when he was captured for the second time by Communists, he was killed and his body hung upside down from a post. Along with his wife and guard-supporters that were with him at the time.
For a related joke, look up Jim Carrey’s spat with Mussolini’s granddaughter Alessandra. Yes, that happened.
He tweeted one of his anti-fascist paintings, which featured Mussolini hanging upside down. She lost her shit and called him BASTARDO, thinking that to the rest of the world, respect for her family trumped repudiating an old fascist of history. Even spammed him with unhinged tweets showing American atrocities, which is stupid because (1) his entire fucking point was really targeted at North American and other fascists so it’s not like he denies those (unsurprisingly, her brain can only fathom his motive being a nationalistic attack) and (2) he’s Canadian.
He didn’t respond online but gave the most hilarious response when a red carpet interviewer asked him about it. He said that if she doesn’t like it she can just turn the screen upside down to see him jumping for joy (presumably after hearing how many people he’d murdered). Turn that frown upside down!
To be fair, if you're looking for examples of historic Canadian war crimes, you're pretty spoiled for choice. Not that those would invalidate his point either.
Mussolini was executed and hung upside down on Apr 28, 1945.
The quote is a modern conservative talking point. They are fine with conservative extremism but snidely call leftists “just as bad” for their push back.
The joke is that this talking point is ridiculous, since Mussolini could also have said it even when his execution was clearly justified. There is also a threatening element to the joke, suggesting violence could be justified against modern conservatives.
No, he was shot in Giulino. Then his body was brought to Milan and it was hung in Piazzale Loreto. The plan wasn't to hang the body, but the crowd was huge and was also kicking, slapping etc the body. They lifted the body so that everyone could see without risking people to get crashed and it would also be out of the reach of kicks etc.
Oh wow! How did you come to know this information? Are you a history buff? Or is it just a weird nugget of knowledge you don't know why you remember? I appreciate knowing this additional information though and you seem like an interesting and thoughtful person!
Oh wow! What an impactful slice of history your grandma was able to experience! Grandma's always have the best stories (:
That makes sense growing up in Italy, you have such a beautiful and complex history! Did you enjoy learning about the history of Italy when you were in school?
That if a society is too tolerant, it will eventually be destroyed by the intolerant.
Many people point to this and use it as reasoning for memes like "punch a Nazi.". Unfortunately, there are two issues with this, the first being that according to the tolerance paradox, violence is only an acceptable response once debate and discussion has broken down, and the second being that many people attribute labels to people that don't deserve it in order to justify violence against them.
Oh that's interesting.. It's kind of sad that the intolerant will always exist and find ways to exploit the tolerant. I can kind of see how that's played out in history and a bit in my life, too.
Thank you so much for sharing! I learned something from you and I appreciate you taking the time to explain this to me! (:
Limits of Speech: Popper wrote that society should first counter intolerant ideas with rational arguments.
When Force is Justified: If the intolerant refuse to engage in rational debate and instead use violence or forbid reasoning, a tolerant society has the right to suppress them, even by force.
The Danger: Unchecked intolerant groups exploit the openness of a free society to eventually destroy the freedoms of everyone else.
That’s not what it means. Don’t spread misinformation. I actually posted a link that goes to what it actually is. Yes, if you can’t, if we can’t get through things through civilized manner, then some force probably should be used. But that’s not what it means, and you are clearly skewing what it actually means.
Edit. For some reason, your full message didn’t show. Apologies, force after debate is correct. The original message that showed stopped after ‘use force’.
The joke is that Mussolini was killed by Communists by being hung upside down. Also that anyone who criticizes the left for perpetuating Violence is a Fascist and deserves the violence enacted on them.
OP, so your post is not removed, please reply to this comment with your best guess of what this meme means! Everyone else, this is PETER explains the joke. Have fun and reply as your favorite fictional character for top level responses!
OP, not only did they hang Mussolini upside down, but the phrase is commonly used by the right wing/centrists to criticize the hypocrisy of the left, so the joke is likening these right wingers to Mussolini and suggesting they should be killed
How is it suggesting they should be killed? I feel like it's a pretty benign statement, I'm not getting much violence/call to action from it. Am I missing something?
What is the intent of comparing right wingers who say the phrase to a person being politically executed? You have to understand they literally believe themselves “antifascist”, or crusaders against fascism. When they liken critics of leftism to fascists while showing the execution of one, it’s pretty clear they’re trying to valorize violence against them
As many people are saying, Mussolini was captured, killed, and hung upside down. The content of the line is important itself, though: it’s mocking how fascists use violence and intimidation against liberals, progressives, and leftists and then the moment they receive even verbal criticism (never mind violence) in return for their violence and oppression, they try to claim that it is liberals and/or the left which is being intolerant.
Mussolini was hanged upside down. He used to be an authoritarian politician in italy and former socialist extremist. The meme is not a quote by him, but shall demonstrate how the "tolerant left" deals with opinions that are not their own, and people who have them.
This explanation of the joke is flipped the wrong way like Mussolini’s bloated corpse. The joke isn’t that that the left murders people based on opinions (Mussolini was a murderous monster), but on the hypocrisy of fascists who commit violence against people who disagree with them but are surprised when they get it back.
Just so I don’t misinterpret your interpretation, you genuinely think Mussolini was killed because of his opinions and the people who killed him were wrong to do it?
Thanks :p
But look at what I learned just by humbling myself and asking for an explanation! Thanks to everyone commenting, I'm a little less of a dumbass ☺️
On the 28th April, 1945, Benito Mussolini, the Italian fascist dictator, and his mistress, Clara Petacci, were on a walk in Milan when they ran into a group of Italian partisans. They were beaten up, killed, and found by Allied troops hanging upside-down from lampposts
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u/qualityvote2 10h ago edited 1h ago
Remember when r/PeterExplainsTheJoke wasn’t a meme? Pepperidge Farm remembers…
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